No.14625[Last 50 Posts]
Previous thread:
>>13840Life's not fair, especially for fujoshi. Post your frustrations and things that are on your mind, no matter how harsh it sounds, about advantages everyone else has that fujoshi don't get.
No.14626
I like muscular bishies and stuff that looks a bit bara, but I hate full-on bara. Still I'm ashamed.
No.14628
>>14627Because then I'm grouped with people that like bara where the guy looks like a gorilla. Makes me puke.
No.14630
>>14610>Also not sure if it's me, but I feel like fic writing has gotten so much worse the last ~5 years or so. Like most recent shit I see is literally atrocious. Not unprofessional. I mean outright atrocious. I have seen fics that were literally just 10 sentence long summaries. 5+ years ago almost every I touched was at least okay. Many even good, some fantastic. Now most of them sound like a summary of tiktok posts.There was some discussion about this a while ago in one of the fic threads, but the tl;dr was that back in The Day most writers also read books. Now writers either don't read, or what they do read is just fanfic or "Ao3 house style" romantasy. Also, we now have young adults that had ~5 years of covid derailing their education/development entering fandom spaces.
>>14621>VPBased. I agree here too, although it makes me wish for a way to filter by author birth year lol.
No.14632
>>14631this happens to me a lot and then I gaslight myself into thinking I misread the spoiler
No.14633
Like most fujos I am constantly puzzled over where wannabe fujos get those "lesbian" or "FTM" vibes from whenever they talk about literally any characters they like. We talked about this a ton of times. But today was the first time that I wondered if these people even know what the terms "lesbians", "woman" and "trans" mean.
Why now? Because I a currently in a fandom of a game with gay characters and male dominated cast. There are only three female characters in there that vaguely matter and none of them even look much like women or have ANY sort of interaction with other women besides one (1) single scene in which one of them tells the other one to fuck off from a couch. Despite that there are "fujos" that claim the game was very lesbian. Today I saw one of them becoming a fan of it for being "inherently sapphic coded". Thing is, there is NO way that anything here could be seen as lesbian? What the fuck. At best you could say it's because the designs of the women are either manly-looking or they're monsters, but this isn't the same as lesbian. They also call the male characters lesbians.
I always tried to make sense of that shit but honestly I get some Okham's Razor vibes here and maybe the easiest explanation is that these idiots just keep using words for meme reasons without even caring about what they actually mean.
No.14634
>>14633I wonder how much of it is performative. Fujos get guilt-tripped for being "male-centered" for focusing on male characters and being "lesbophobic" for not caring about f/f. So they let the guilt-tripping get to them and act like this alongside their true fujo passions.
No.14635
>>14633I see this kinda talk around sometimes and I think the difference between fujos and these people are that fujos at their core are just "shippers" and they are "reppers". They engage with media entirely on how queer they think they can make it seem whereas we are there because we are making the dolls kiss. Heaven forbid they go read a book written by a gay and/or trans person with canonically gay/trans characters. They want the scout badge but don't actually want to participate.
>>14634>So they let the guilt-tripping get to them and act like this alongside their true fujo passions.I used to think this but these people never actually write/draw stuff for fujos, if they are even writing/drawing at all. Nobody who types like this ever has quality works that offset their terrible posts.
No.14639
>>14638This has to be some kind of psyop. How do none of them realise they are treating real women like shit in favour of fake women?
No.14640
>>14639they don't, it's not about women, they don't care about us, real women, they care about characters that they can relate to and have autistic fantasies about.
These people are all narcissists, they always used misogyny to justify their own narcissim and the inherent need feel catered.
I don't really care thou, I am not guilt tripped by their word salad and manipulative words anymore, so they can scream to the void as much as they want. But it's sad other fujos see that some schizo nobody on twitter says "fujo evil" and feels bad about it.
No.14641
>>14638As someone who lurks in both CN and EN communities it's really not a CCP psyop. The CN antifujos belong to the CN radfem crowd whose ideals for feminism are still stuck in 10's tumblr idpol with Bechdel tests equivalents as yardstick for defining whether a piece of work is feminist or misogynist. It's the same kind of pixel fauxminism you have in EN communities at the moment. Call it comparative fauxminism or whatever.
>You are not required to like BL but just because you can't self insert doesn't mean you have to hate it, these people are inherently annoyed at porn when the whole reason they are annoyed is because they feel alienated from the porn and not the porn itself.Ironically they don't share the same level of vitriol for hentai as they do for yaoi (similarly, they don't go after porn creators who are male as often as they do after the female ones). But I suppose hentai puts female pleasure/orgasms front and center, and you have tons of female representation so they don't feel alienated.
No.14642
I hate that twitter's newest changes killed the "RT" culture. Asians would always leave some nice comments on their profile after retweeting art, no that the retweets are separated from the original posts you can't do it anymore since nobody knows which RT they're referring to.
>>14638The first post is such a bad case of ESL that I don't even know what the fuck they're trying to say. I am too autistic to understand grammar-gibber.
The second post? Congratulations for falling for right-wing psyops that try to make you hate gay shit because gay is evil to them. Fucking idiots.
"Hurr durr a series doesn't pander to men, this means it's misgynist". This is the bullshit they say.
No.14643
>>14638>First screenshotI swear these "reformed fujos" who complain about how much fujos "center men" are disgruntled yumes who got tired of pretending that they like their fandom's main couple when they simply husbandofag for one of them.
>Second screenshotI understand women growing up in a suffocatingly patriarchal and misogynist countries and who are obsessed with militant separatism due to their cultural context openly hating women turning into political lesbianism and being angry but they can not fucking call fujos detrimental to feminism when each one of their own has a k-pop/adjacent PFP and staunchly support multibillion dollar industries that starve young women to the point they faint on stage, force them into extreme plastic surgery and sex work to advance their careers and then put them under celibacy to feed into their parasocial fans' fantasies. All of them have at least one idol girl that they are convinced to be a slaying yass queen undercover lesbian and who will surely change the status quo to celebrate women when she's your garden variety product who will never express an opinion in public. They're living an escapist fantasy.
>>14639>>14640They've internalized a lot of misogynist ideas from around them and became this very specific brand of NLOG where only they have ascended to see the truth and every other woman is a vapid male worshiping dumb bitch who hasn't seen the light. Like
>>14641 said it's very baby's first steps towards feminism thought.
No.14646
Just saw this gem and it summaries the whole issue I have with online idiots. I fucking hate it when people use words for fun, without meaning them. I also hate memes. I hate this whole meme obsessed culture that only talks in memes and catch phrases instead of forming original sentences and I hate people who are into something for the memes. Shipping gay for le funny meme, being trans for meme, talking quirky for memes. Fuck off.
>>14644Social media addiction is the worst shit that has ever happened to human brains after religious mindfuckery. But the latter was at least restricted to certain cultures and times, this here is global and I doubt that it will go away.
No.14647
>>14641>they don't share the same level of vitriol for hentai of course they don't.
>>14642Unironically i think it is, entertainment industries didn't hate lesbian couples with the same intensity of gay couples, because women having sex with women is enjoyable for men to watch, so they are very convienently doing everything the mass media is ok with lol
No.14648
>>14646Words don't have any meaning and everything has to be irony poisoned at all times because being sincere and holding on to definitions in an environment where millions of eyes will always be watching you and one small mistake will make you the main character of the day makes you extremely exposed and vulnerable. So you always have to keep the wiggle room of reasonable doubt to allow backpedaling. But in return this has given birth to this kind of insincere meme culture where everything is just aesthetics and social capital to accumulate followers instead of forming genuine connection with the people around you.
No.14649
>>14644why people with the chudjak look are always retarded
No.14650
>>14641>they don't go after porn creators who are male as often as they do after the female onesThis is the main reason I'll never be able to take any of these "militant feminists" seriously. They know, deep down, that harassing men for making grotesque porn is a herculean task since they have the number advantage and are far more aggressive if they perceive a threat to their "culture". Women are generally easier to guilt trip and harass into silence, everytime I see a female artist getting shit it's always for the stupidest reasons such as that one asian artist that was harassed and called racist for not drawing the princess and the frog prince when she drew other disney princes, you don't even have to do anything especially heinous. Of course these people are nowhere to be found when women online receive unjust harassment, hell a lot of the time they're right there alongside the angry mob. Once I start seeing these antifujos actually successfully harass a male porn artist into quitting social media instead of sperging about da fujosharts I might actually develop some respect for them.
No.14651
>>14642In an ideal world this would make people more likely to leave direct comments because I don't have time to check every RT in case someone said something, but in practice I guess it'll probably just lead to no one leaving any kind of comment at all.
No.14652
>>14644>virtue signaling about children>says boymomlol right the term boymom, the new term that is being thrown around on women who just love their babies, is it the new pickme?
But yeah no you care about children thou, greasy hair chan.
No.14653
>>14638It's such an alien mentality. I'm not saying that no work with het romance can be feminist, but I've always preferred female protagonists/characters to not have a romantic interest when I want to read about them. Women being in the (het) romance or titillation box is so default that a story which simply centers around a woman with none of those things is automatically significant, and I wonder how people like this feel about such works. BL is a space which is free of all that. Women not being involved in the romance is a feature, not a bug. I don't care if the Het LI treats his gf perfectly by RL standards and lets her peg him, a romance between two men is something I don't feel any personal connection to as an observer and my brain isn't actively aware of the inherently loaded gender dynamic at all times. It's as neutral as watching two sentient blocks fall in love, except two men are hotter than sentient blocks.
There is also a shit ton of het media, especially villainess slop, where only the MC matters and everyone else is a bitch in her way. Het absolutely has the lead on treating female characters badly right now.
No.14654
>>14638I don't get these retards. If I wanted to read a book centered around female characters, I would read literally anything else. If I wanted het, I would read or make het.
>>14643>these "reformed fujos" who complain about how much fujos "center men" are disgruntled yumeAnd they act like born again Christians with a superiority complex
>I was once a fujo, but then I realized that being a yume is better than every way and that it was all just porn addiction!I don't understand how yume or het-oriented content is higher-quality or less cringe than BL overall either kek.
>>14644CSAM cannot be fictional. Words or drawings are not CP or CSAM.
No.14655
>>14646Contrapoints is a troon so I wonder if he got backlash for this and backpedaled at some point. It's certainly a correct take either way.
No.14658
>>14654These are the same who suddenly stop reading/liking BL once they get a boyfriend. Fucking fake ass bitches.
No.14660
>>14658i never understood it. if all it takes is some guy coming into your life to extinguish all your creative passion, did you even like the thing in the first place?
No.14661
>>14638Sometimes I wish I was a guy because they don't have to deal with this shit. Nobody in waifufag spaces goes "ERMM AREN'T YOU CENTERING WOMEN TOO MUCH? WHY DON'T YOU CARE ABOUT MALES?". Why are women always expected to, by other women, to be doing some righteous cause with what they like?
Also, this account sounds like a troll. Or probably one of the super ultra radfem chink lesbians I guess. Their entire profile is dedicated towards RPF so I don't think they care or give a shit about fujo culture, they just want to goon over women.
No.14662
>>14653>but I've always preferred female protagonists/characters to not have a romantic interest when I want to read about them.Big same. My favorite girl characters tend to be the secondary ones who aren't often under the Sword of Damocles that is a shitty canon romance. She can be flustered by attention or even have a crush/shiptease, but I want her to be so focused on her own shit that these things do not bog down the fandom around her.
No.14663
>>14658Fake fans like that actually exist? That is so weird. I can't imagine not liking BL anymore just because of that.
No.14664
>>14663Yes, and sometimes you'll hear "I stopped liking/being into BL and gay ships when I lost weight." If it's not a moid, it's their physical appearance. How the fuck do you even meme yourself into liking BL and gay shipping like that? How pathetic do you have to be to avoid het or yume content until you finally landed a man or got the stacy body? Have some self respect jfc
No.14667
>>14664I've seen both fujos/yumes admit their interest in said things were primarily due to self-esteem issues and relationship hang-ups and it's kinda sad. They're aware it's just cope for them but are fine with it because it makes them happy in the moment I guess. Basically the epitome of failed normies who will drop those interests at the at the drop of a hat.
No.14668
Take a shot every time an antifujo complains about too much yaoi existing on LC or WC.
No.14669
>>14668Maybe I'm just "no fun allowed" but the posting-style and culture of WC is really cringy.
No.14670
>>14669they are self-admitted stunted autists who play roblox and watch TADC. It was inevitable.
No.14671
>>14670>who play roblox and watch TADCUnrelated maybe but this reminds me that I saw a post on LC where an anon was blaming fujos for not liking the frog because "she's probably getting in the way of yaoi" (regarding Jax).
I don't care about TADC but how braindead must you be to not have been aware of how much people hetshipped Jax? If anything, the only criticism there is nowadays is if you DON'T acknowledge him as heckinnn transfemm
No.14672
>>14664it's because they finally can self insert without feeling like they are no way near as attractive as the self insert
No.14673
>>14664Fat fujos being a stereotype is why I initially got fit lmao
No.14674
>>14671>blaming fujos for not liking the frog because "she's probably getting in the way of yaoi"lol is this bitch serious? there were barely any M/M ships for TADC, and all of Jax's popular ships were het. The only TADC ships that got any attention were het and yuri. That nonna has fujoshi derangement syndrome
No.14675
>>14663Yeah it's a thing. Going into my 20's I lost a lot of long time fujo friends who suddenly lost interest in BL after they entered their first serious relationship. Some of them eventually circled back in their 30's though, I do feel like they were just insecure about liking something their boyfriends found nasty until they grew a spine.
>>14664>>14667The "I'm too ugly and single for het stuff" is such a bitter place to enjoy something from and I've seen it happen too. I understand it and I don't really judge because fujo stuff offering a respite from the ridiculous expectations placed on women is one of its big appeals but I wish they wouldn't be made to feel like they have to choose.
No.14676
>>14664To the contrary, I try to look my best and live my best successful life to become the fujostacy I aspire to be. I hate the fat ugly loser TIF fujo stereotype — I’ve seen plenty of conventionally attractive fujos and successful fujos who work in careers in science, medicine, tech, business, etc who are no less passionate about BL. Fujos come in all shapes and sizes from all walks of life.
>>14673Hell yeah good for you. All that sports anime BL is great motivation too.
No.14678
>>14677Dangerously based and queen shit right there. Defend Zoro's honor!
No.14679
>>14664>>14675>>14677>too ugly and single for het stuffLiking BL because you want to self-insert or live vicariously through the fmc but can't is a sad mentality. I'm not judging because low self-esteem affects your entire life. Although I understand it however, the mentality is a bit alien to me since I don't think about myself when escaping into fiction. I've felt isolated from other women because of that at times.
>What he did this to you?!I don't want to think about characters interacting with me
No.14680
>>14678thank you, kek, I don't play about zoro or any other fictional men I love. if a guy wants to get with me he just has to accept that I'm a fujo. I'm very lenient about moid hobbies too in return but most moids are deeply insecure in the first place. it's just not worth the hassle of bothering with them.
>>14679>I don't want to think about characters interacting with meI feel this. I also love reading and the new wave of readers (prevalent on booktok) are largely weirdos because they always need to feel represented and included and whatnot. reading and other media is for me to be entertained, not to be part of. then again, I also never enjoyed making a sims self in sims 2 and playing my "dream life", I only ever play with OCs.
No.14681
>>14638I thought it was only english speakers who pulled this "muh bl is misogyny" shit. And like you said they can never provide any actual reason as to why it's misogynistic, and no being "male-centered" and the absence of female characters doesn't count, it's just a way for horny women to get off. These women just want an excuse to police others and are mad that they don't share the same tastes as them. Mind you women in china actually get jailed over making bl but I guess it's okay since they're the evil oppressors apparently.
>>14679>Liking BL because you want to self-insert or live vicariously through the fmc but can't is a sad mentalityI like to dabble in het and yume content occasionally but I honestly blame this on how a good chunk of fmcs are depicted along with other moidy tropes that are typically found in that genre. In shoujo/otome for example the mc will sometimes look super cutesy at worst, but in hentai for women the heroine either looks like jailbait or is drawn with noticeably titillating proportions and the focus is mostly on her body during nsfw scenes, which would only drive most readers away. A lot of femgaze hentai also features rape and the fmc is either a massive doormat or acts like a child. Luckily there's a couple series that don't feature male gaze elements but they're heavily outnumbered. Lc also has a thread on /m/ where they offer recommendations and complain about it if it helps.
No.14682
This is somewhat about Goodbye Lara but bear with me because it helps analyzing what I am observing among gay haters as well. So there is an idiot saying she hated yuri but is still watching Lara because she hopes that MC will get together with the boy after all. Confronted with people questioning her media literacy she gets mad and replies it's not yuri because it "isn't tagged" as such and "not everything is shipping".
I see this shit all the time with anti-gays as well. Are people literally too brain dead to watch a fucking show? Do they really need MAL to tell them whether a series is gay or straight? Like Lara's whole fucking plot is about her realizing that the guy she had a crush on for being a pretty prince isn't what true love is. It's impossible to watch that series without knowing the fucking story so I have to question the sanity of hetfags here and I observe this with tons of series with gays as well.
Basically not being tagged as yaoi means it's not yaoi even if the characters are openly gay (like the dude from Sparks of Tomorrow right now). So why the fuck isn't het shit tagged then? Are Nuruto and TTLG tagged as "het romance"? Fucking no. And despite that nobody would watch the romance with Nia unfold and pretend it was just friendship.
I swear het fans are so fucking unbearable.
No.14683
>>14664I legit never met a fat fujo in my life. Wonder if it's more of an American phenomenon. I also don't understand the connection. Because they want bfs and don't get them they get into gay stuff instead? I hope this isn't true for many because I always disliked fans who only like something because they couldn't get some mundane shit in real life and only treated fiction consumption as coping mechanism instead of a genuine interest. This is why (male) otaku are so damn annoying, they're mostly failed normalfags that fap to little 2D girls because nobody gifts them a trophy waifu for free in reality.
That said though it's not necessarily otaku or fujo related. I lost my best female friend when she got boyfriends too long ago. She wasn't a fujo but she lost all interest in manga/anime and horror (we were massive horror fans as teens) in general afterwards, it was like a spell. Met her one time again years later and the only thing she liked was Twilight then and I had 0 interest in that so we mostly tried and failed to do small talk.
Dunno maybe I am not the right guy to discuss this with since I never had a crush on a real person or craved romance IRL. All I need
is a cute animal to pet, that's all the physical interaction that I need in real life.
>>14668Retarded question but what is WC? Another anon image board?
No.14684
>>14677i ditched the only guy i was ever with because he couldn't accept my hobbies lol.
No.14685
>>14682>but is still watching Lara because she hopes that MC will get together with the boy after allAnd people aren't dogpiling on her? lmao it sounds to me like she likes Luca herself mostly and uses Lara to self-insert. This was common for Suletta/Elan shippers for Gwitch when it was airing.
The show beats you constantly with telling you that even if Lara is forcing herself to like Luca, it's not her ideal choice. Besides, everything about it simply already felt yuri to begin with? It had a very ikuhara-style sorta feeling to it even before airing.
It sounds to me that some people clearly see heterosexuality as 'the norm' and don't want to make it too obvious they do hate gay relationships so they cope about it that it's about the writing or the lack of tags or whatever.
No.14686
>>14685Pressed sent too soon.
Anyway, personally I don't think the show will go full on yuri and do the friendship angle pull (as it usually happens) but this is still not a confirmation of het. I've been watching the show but try to avoid as much discussion of it as possible elsewhere, because as you say it's deranged hetfags vs yurifags vs shitposters vs everyone else
No.14687
>>14683WC is Witchan which yes is an imageboard made by a woman for women, and she claims it's for "freedom to post" she's a shotacon so she allows people to post stuff relating to that there but in general it's more lax on who can make threads like 4chan. They allow yaoi but there's already been a couple of threads made complaining about yaoi/fujos (not that that stops me from using it), go check it out if you want another non-moidy ib.
>>14684Based anon, this is why my ideal relationship is with someone who either has completely different hobbies so they don't gaf at all or pretty similar ones so we can relate. If someone has had a hobby for majority of their life what makes you think you can get them to drop it for your unwashed ass that came into their life a month ago?
No.14688
>>14687>if you want another non-moidy ib. That's not what the global rules say.
No.14689
>>14688Didn't she justify the lack of "no moids rule" with saying that it just attracted baiting scrotes if she put it? She still does ban them.
No.14690
>>14689She did. Half the witches understood her intentions/4D chess plan and the other half just couldn't use their brain to figure it out kek.
No.14691
>>14690>Nimu>4D chessSus post baka desu senpai
No.14692
>>14690Yeah I mean if LC was just an ib made by women w/ no other stipulations it wouldn't live rent-free in a lot of male ib users heads if not for the fact that it's explicitly only for women. Nimu has already taken several measures (from telling the AllChans moderator to take down the link (?) or something relating to that to WC, and making it so you can't look it up on google) to protect her ib idk why people think she's subtly caping for/inviting moids. Fujochan gets no bait ONLY because yaoi is such a scrote-repellant males only come here to raid, they can't be bothered to have conversations about BL.
No.14693
>>14682>Basically not being tagged as yaoi means it's not yaoi even if the characters are openly gay (like the dude from Sparks of Tomorrow right now).This is bad comparison. Side homo is fine (esp if villains) main characters are another thing altogether.
No.14694
>>14691Kek, sorry anon I'm not Nimu. I don't think I'd want to deal with witches' daily complaints about dumb stuff.
>>14692I guess it's because, if my memory serves me right, she once made a post on wc's /meta/ that was something like "moids are welcome to post" so she could snip lurking scrotes and everyone ran with it.
No.14695
>>14693What are some animanga series that haven't been tagged as BL despite involving endgame homo w/ the MC? All I can think of is YOI & Ao No Flag and this one shojo manga called Kieta Hatsukoi. Usually though it's cases like the last one I mentioned where it's a shojo so it's still categorized/made for women right?
No.14696
>>14692Extrait de BL is extremely potent. They could never understand its complexity and the artistry behind its craft.
No.14698
>>14682>>14685>It sounds to me that some people clearly see heterosexuality as 'the norm' This is 100% it, both with yuri and yaoi, and jp fans especially do this all the time. If there's any subtext, or even an actual gay character, these fans will just discard it as 'fanservice' for the fujos, they don't even consider it an actual possibility because to them the only romantic relationships that can exist are het. And those het relationships don't even need much, a guy and a girl just need to exist and maybe have one conversation, while male/female only relationships that are much deeper and have more nuance constantly get reduced to simply friendship.
They will often say that they're not homophobic, and their favourite argument that follows is 'if you want gay relationships you should read BL!', but the problem is exactly how they don't want gay relationships to exist outside of its' defined 'niche' so to say. If a media is mainstream and doesn't have the BL tag, it's expected that the romance should be het no matter what. All this applies to yuri too.
It's a difficult line, because on one hand you have authors that just don't know how to write female characters so you end up with unintentional fujobait (shounens), but there are also authors that want to add gay elements to their works that aren't tagged as BL, and certain fans will try to het-ify it regardless because in the end it's as simple as not wanting to see gay people in their series (even if they try to make many excuses for it).
No.14699
>>14698>but the problem is exactly how they don't want gay relationships to exist outside of its' defined 'niche' so to sayHell, they don't want that niche to exist in the first place.
No.14700
>>14695with BL like kieta hatsukoi it’s still widely known as BL because the gay romance is the main plot. With the existence of BL magazines now some people think an obvious BL somehow isn’t one just because it’s in non-BL mag, even though BL as a genre started out in non-BL mags (mainly shoujo) and there are still some BL authors nowadays who still choose to go with a non-BL mag for a variety of reasons. if the two mains are gay it’s BL
No.14701
>>14695>What are some animanga series that haven't been tagged as BL despite involving endgame homo w/ the MC?Bizarro outlier are The Transformers. As it is both an English and Japanese production with both North American media and Japanese exclusive shows and manga.
The cast is 99% male, and while there are some M/F pairings, it isn't guaranteed that the lead male will end up with one of the 3 important fembots. Between the western shows, the Japanese anime, the comics and manga, it's a roulette wheel.
It is also wholly random if it will be a serious romance or a gag. Pic related are a serious M/F pairing in English. But in Japanese, they are a M/M couple. In a gag dub.
No.14702
>>14697It says online it's published/marketed as Josei, so while I'm happy we have another slow-burn gay romance, it tracks this was allowed by that kind of publisher.
>>14700That's true but it starts out w/ the guy crushing over the girl and initially the "romance" b/w the guys is a misunderstanding Guy #2 takes too seriously and decides to give the MC's "feelings" serious consideration before rejecting him (again), and readers/MC are misled to believe the FMC likes Guy #2. It now is known as gay but I'm sure initially, especially since the FMC was put in a lot of marketing, it was unsure. I wish I knew where the JP commented on various series because I want to know if the bait&switch caused a lot of angry hetjoshis who dropped the series kek.
>some people think an obvious BL somehow isn’t one just because it’s in non-BL magIt's a whole new marketing angle now, same reason why Sasaki To Miyano's author had the author's agent recommend for her to not to market it as a BL, despite it being incredibly focused on gay romance. So yeah that kind of thinking is outdated.
>>14701I love seeing you transformers fans pop up. And how complicated but that tracks since based on google, the backstory for the Transformers was created by the West even if the actual robots were a pre-existing Japanese toy right? So it's kind of like capeshit. The changing of genders seems like perfect bait for gendies so you have my condolences for how how retarded the fans must get. Do the wiki editors get into slapfights about "canonicty" too?
No.14703
>>14702>Do the wiki editors get into slapfights about "canonicty" too?Wiki is run by the least funny straight boomers alive. They make fun of Japanese culture more than they do fans of the series. I have made these men upset in person because they think I consume their show wrong (actually analyzing the character intent.)
TF fandom is more diverse than a Canadian middle school.
You got
G1 fans who are also white and 40
Fujos (NA)
Fujos (China)
Tiktok kids (edit fans)
Tiktok kids (shippers and NOT actually the same as the fujos of either country)
Bayverse fans (male)
Bayverse fans (autistic)
Bayverse fans (has only seen clips online)
And this is not getting into the comics, or anime, or manga.
No.14704
>>14703>countrySorry Canada I meant USA in my head. Oh god my USAmerica is showing I'm sorry
No.14705
>>14695Bravern for example. The IDW Transformer comics, though it doesn't really have one specific MC. Probably Himitsu too. I actually thought that the latter was a yaoi because it seemed and looked like one, but it is usually not tagged as such AFAIK. Anyway, people that care about tags like the ones mentioned are retarded. Double retarded if it's an original anime. Where should some rando on MAL even know how the series will end to tag it?
I hate this zoomer mentality that needs others to tell them what to watch and what the expect and I blame them for why seasonal anime threads are so dead nowadays. Nobody enjoys surprises anymore or watches anything that isn't their super specific fetish niche. The majority wants to be fed and they only listen if some shitty youtuber tells them to "binge" a series and spoiler the content otherwise they don't even that a series exists. That aside, the TTGL romance that anons talked about involves the MC and it's still not tagged as romance. Such tags are unnecessary unless the romance is in the focus otherwise almost everything would be tagged with it.
No.14706
>>14703Oh yeah and the worst is that all these types of fans intermingle and many of them aren't capable of understanding the concept of a new universe, so they use Bayverse canon to argue about plot points in TF Animated or something.
Though the good thing about boomers and male haters is that eventually shut up if a newer series is too gay or has too much decent character writing (they only want pew pew and one-liners). Who personally annoys me the most are the clip/meme/edit fans that talk about shit they don't know anything about (actually a huge problem in most modern fandoms, but TF in particular) and the continuity soup fic writers. I am too autistic for that. And if I love a story and world I don't want it to be mixed up with other worlds, so I will never be able to get into the popular ships like Jazz/Prowl despite loving Prowl, simply because they all ship the comicbook Prowl with the G1 or Animated Jazz.
tbh I am slightly annoyed how even some of my friends are telling me that like series based on outtakes and memes of it as that was the same as actually watching or reading something. I feel like so many people have lost the ability to focus that they prefer to watch tiktok summaries or skim over 4chan discussions threads.
No.14707
>>14705>IDW TransformersEach story kind of had its own MC but there were so many going on at once, you could honestly just say Optimus, Hot Rod, Bumblebee and Starscream. Prowl and Springer have the Wreckers but even then. The writers were fighting for their favorites so you got this weird mish mash where the antagonists feel more like the Mcs depending on the issue. Verity is the MC for like 4 of them until it's back to someone else. Marvel does that too. Pic related.
As for seasonal series, I think a certain youtuber who does seasonal reviews has poisoned watching anime in the west to the point if he doesn't mention it, it will not be seen. And all he likes is romance, isekai, tsundere focused romance and isekai.
He's also a fucking anti so if a show is actually interesting, just problematic in a way that he doesn't like, it's going to get flamed. He glazed pedo MC's isekai but wants to act like incest is too much to talk about. I get there being too much to talk about, but all his videos are just shounen, something flashy, romance, lame "realistic" romance that isn't really realistic the tone is just muted, and more lukewarm IQ garbage. I can never remember his username, I'll end up trying gguk and gigguk until it works.
>>14706The fans being so diverse is a problem for discussion outside of a curated echo chamber. You're stuck with a small group who wont have too varied of an opinion or you end up arguing with a 14 year old who genuinely thinks their yumeship is canon on all the sites for talking at large.
Reddit, is genuinely the worst place online to talk about anything because they treat shipping like, spitting on the writers' hands. So if you so much as make a joke, you'll get downvoted. ie, my goat wouldn't followed by an image of optimus flipping you off or the photoshop expression. I wanted to see more people talk about cyberworld and skybound in a way that acknowledges pairings but also the story. Like Astrotrain's 'love.' I guess I'm just stuck with twitter because I'm not joining a valveplug discord to do it.
No.14710
>>14705>The majority wants to be fed and they only listen if some shitty youtuber tells them to "binge" a series and spoiler the content otherwise they don't even that a series exists.And then, shockingly, the only shows they end up ever hearing about are shock schlock waifu of the month shit. They immediately throw their hands in the air about how nothing good is made anymore and that there's no point in even trying, even though they didn't do shit to begin with.
No.14713
>>14695No. 6
>>14682>Do they really need MAL to tell them whether a series is gay or straight?Yes, because I don't want to waste time on watching trash that doesn't cater to my interests. Bet you would be singing a different tune if the 'futa' and 'magical sex shift' tags didn't exist and you stumbled upon something like Oniichan wa Oshimai.
>>14705>Anyway, people that care about tags like the ones mentioned are retarded. Double retarded if it's an original anime. Where should some rando on MAL even know how the series will end to tag it? Heavens forbid people watch shows to completion before tagging them! If there was romance, but it ended in one of the main characters dying, should the work not be tagged as 'tragedy'? Or if the show was all-ages, but included gratuitous sex scenes in the last couple of episode should it not be tagged as 'erotica'? What do you even use tags for, if you use them at all?
No.14714
>>14707>giggukIs he not the one openly into lolis? Incest is where he draws the line? At this point I cheer just finding any anituber who is even neutral about the existence of anime incest.
No.14715
>>14714I remember years ago when I watched his videos for a bit that he glazed Eromanga Sensei with the whole "anime is trash and so am I" bit.
No.14716
>>14714Which is interesting because I feel like incest/pseudoincest is common in animanga, idk if as common as lolisho characters but still a frequent punchline.
No.14718
>>14713Maybe I'm just too woke but I don't really see the issue with a show/manga containing a gay romance despite not being specifically tagged as yaoi/yuri. I get it if romance is the main focus of the series or if it contains sex scenes that it might be a turn-off but at the end of the day I don't see it as a dealbreaker.
No.14719
>>14718Yeah same. I mean western series aren't tagged that way either, are they? I surely didn't expect a doomed gay romance when I started Severance but here I am. There are two ways of tagging IMO. One is the autistic one that danbooru/tvtropes use, to search for very specific preferences and find every work containing it, regardless of how relevant it is. And then there are the normal tags which is what MAL, imbd and the likes use which are about the genre and demographic. Nobody tags something as gay, self-cest or age-gap if these things didn't play the central role in the story.
>>14713>but it ended in one of the main characters dying, should the work not be tagged as 'tragedy'? Yeah this exactly. Tagging should never include spoilers. Same as the MC's death at the end the BL tag is only used if a series is openly BL from the start (and only if it's about the MCs), so all that hoping and coping het fags do because a series doesn't scream GAY in the first seconds is kinda retarded.
Imagine arguing with someone who believed that the team/fake MCs from ep. 01 of Ga-Rei-Zero will return because the series wasn't tagged as "major character death (multiple)", meaning that they aren't actually death because the tags don't say so. I blame tumblr's trigger warning brainrot for this.
No.14723
>>14653Sorry for the late reply, I agree with almost all your points and the sentient blocks gave me a good chuckle, but I have to speak up on villainess media. I keep seeing people spit villainess out just because it's gotten common these days but villainess media is about subversion. If you look at the most popular villainess titles they all involve neutralizing the villainess's fate by making her -friends- with the heroine and/or the heroine's female friends. At least three go as far as having the heroine fall for the villainess. I've found myself enjoying a number because they've been good at treating female characters well and giving them personalities and plot purposes outside of pairing up with boys (though that's still a recurring theme given most are dating sim parodies, they do put emphasis on there being better match ups than any boy and any girl). Saint series I would argue are more biased towards all male casts and inexplicably hateful female rivals, they still play out a conventional villain/ess formula to make the good girl saint look like an underdog. I would even say that holy maiden/saint media can be the female audience equivalent to men's abandoned from the hero's party type stories. They are usually about a girl who has been overlooked and underappreciated and is then rewarded for her diligence and cheat skills through some miraculous good fortune allowing her to show others up. Those types of story tend to set their scenes using convenient bullies and discrimination.
No.14728
>>14713>Heavens forbid people watch shows to completion before tagging them!Nona, forgive me if I'm misunderstanding you, but I think they meant tagging before the show finishes airing. With anime originals random MAL users won't know how it ends until the ending airs. They suggest seasonal discussion is dying because people are upset by a lack of foreknowledge, as though unexpected events in an animated TV show are a huge grievance. Not knowing where you're headed is the central appeal of watching an original weekly, it's been the appeal of serialized stories for centuries. The tiktok generation takes media so seriously they ironically demand higher levels of control over what they consume to the point of being repulsed by uncertainty.
No.14735
I just thought back to how both Welcome to night vale and The magnus protocol have a gay romance that I just felt absolutely nothing for. I'm trying to analyze this and maybe the podcast format makes me associate these characters too much with their real actors and it turns me off cause it gets too close to RPF even though they're obviously playing characters.
No.14737
>>14735did you mean the magnus archives? I never bothered with the magnus protocol because of the protag troon and his grating voice. but yeah, I didn't like John/Martin much either. I think it's the kind of fluffy feel good representation that is appealing to normies who are offended by everything. also yeah, the voice actors are ugly irl and I can't look past that (or the fandom makes them ugly/uglier by making John some ugly hairy Indian guy and Martin obese). I feel like John really wanted the woke brownie points for a gay end couple but the idea of seeing yaoi content of it freaked him out so they made sure to throw in the "John is asexual" thing.
No.14738
>>14737Yeah my bad. I meant Archives. I haven't started protocol yet but I dunno if I want to at this point.
>I think it's the kind of fluffy feel good representation that is appealing to normies who are offended by everything>so they made sure to throw in the "John is asexual" thing.Those are good points too. The asexual thing in particular feels like such a copout to me. Even though there's canonically some conflict between them in the end it does feel like a tame western ~representation~ sort of relationship.
No.14742
>>14737>the fandom makes them ugly/uglierI’ve never listened to it before but were they never actually described like that?
No.14743
>>14742in s1 when Martin encounters Jane Prentiss for the first time and gives a statement he says he's not a small guy, which could also mean that he's just a bit overweight or maybe very tall. aside from that we never get any descriptions of their appearances. it's just weird that the fandom then chooses to go for the ugliest options possible instead of just headcanoning them as at least somewhat handsome.
No.14745
Funny how yumetards and incel ai hetsloppers were making big drama whereas fujos just minding their business.
Usually incel hetsloppers make ntr and femdom shitty art, some of them made with ai.
No.14746
>>14745I've seen more yumes hating on fujos than the reverse, they really live in their heads rent free. Also the vast majority of hetslop art made by incels is ai nowadays because they're just that lazy and untalented, even the shit they draw by hand sucks.
No.14747
>>14746I can't stand how selfish, delulu yumetards are, they even fight over same boring bland male character, non-sharing are the biggest delulu.
Sucks how seeing fem charas made in aislop by pervy, betacuck simps with femdom fetish (some deranged lesbos too.) made me almost hate the fem chara. Her fans are incels and femcels, not to mention those incels/femcels shat on other fem charas.
I'm glad fujos are more sensible & not wasting time arguing with yume/yuritards & hetsloppers.
No.14754
>>14747I don't know how nonsharers aren't shat on more, I actually get happy seeing other women who share the same husbando as me. You have to be really mentally ill and insecure to shit yourself over other people having the same husbando or even seeing him getting shipped with other characters. It's even worse when said character is super popular because what are you gonna do if it's someone like gojo kek
No.14758
>Draw smut of your favourite m/m couple because I love both characters and the ship
>People comment on how hot the top is, how down bad they are for him and how much they wished they could switch places with the bottom character
I do not GIVE A SHIT. The bottom is there for a reason! They're a package deal! This isn't made for your self insertion fantasies! Stop fucking commenting cringe shit like this! This makes me go on such an embarrassingly autistic fit of rage it takes all my willpower not to go on a blocking spree and scream at people not to interact unless they're into the ship kek
No.14764
>>14758Free yourself and block them nonna. Curate your fujo space
No.14766
Kinda funny when a person who projects onto a canon LI with 5 seconds of screen time has the audacity to complain about m/m shippers not making Male A "show emotions" when A canonically keeps his emotions extremely close to his chest & literally denied/hated being human (and thus weak & vulnerable) so much he split his being into two to preserve himself (and in his POV loose his weakness). Sorry to adhere to canon I guess.
No.14774
>>14766I think an important thing to remember is that like, a solid half of fans don't actually watch/read the thing they're 'fans' of these days. They probably don't even know canon.
No.14779
>>14774That's true, but I find this particularly baffling with husbandofags (mentally I'm including those who deny being one under the guise of "I just like this ship" and the ship in question has no screen time as well as the other half of the ship having none as well). How are you going to stand on a leg against misogynistic fetishistic fujos, especially ones who like incest, when you fundamentally misunderstand the character involved? I guess I'll be more specific this person complaining said fujos don't make Male A "feel emotions" when the period of time he got with the LI (mind you we have nothing besides the word of the English VA that said relationship had emotional depth, that's how little we know about this relationship lmao it was basically written just to make Male A have a kid) was before he learned he was stronger with his humanity/human side intact, so he was still denying it & trying to distance himself from it & had that typical arrogance of youth about him as he was trying to obtain a massive amount of power. How are you going to argue that's a period of time when he would've been willingly vulnerable in front of a stranger? I would say nearly every character in this series (besides like one female character) is emotionally constipated in general so that is a very odd complaint. But yeah you're right they don't care about canon they just want to make their generic sexualized idea of this female character and act like feminists. This applies to fujos too but at least the ones who critique other people's characterization are ones who can back up their claims lmao (also now that I think about it plenty of fujos do make male A openly express emotions, so this complaint just seems even more stupider to me the more I think about it????)
No.14780
>>14758I'm the exact same kek I'm glad I'm not alone in this type of sperging. Unfortunately though, I genuinely don't want to write any smut between my ship because I don't want to give content to the topfags. In my fandom it is that bad that people don't care about 90% of the cast, they just want to see the popular guy (which unfortunately I do like too) fuck anyone.
No.14784
>>14779anon just mention the fandom/characters, this whole "character A" bs is confusing.
No.14785
I'm really tired of keeping my tumblr fujo friends around. I don't get it. So it's not the noncon itself but it's TOO much noncon and now that makes it weird? I don't care how morally good you think callout moralfag culture is. Take your double edged sword that gets used as a fujo bludgeon at least more than half the time and fuck off oh my god who cares if a fic writer writes too much noncon and not enough fluff? Stop complaining about antis in the fandom if this is how you're going to act ahhh I'm going insane
No.14790
>>14638>the group of women I've hated from BIRTH until now>pfp of some underage child holding the lesbian flagI am always shocked at how the people who claim to be the most empathetical and loving of women, freely say the word "hate" and women so easily, almost as if they are projecting and they are using political lesbianism to cover up for their massive misogyny issues
No.14791
>>14790>almost as if they are projecting and they are using political lesbianism to cover up for their massive misogyny issuesYeah that is exactly what they're doing, falsely slapping the lesbian/"sapphic" label onto themselves so that they can call other women bitches and bash them for not sharing the same tastes and line of thought.
No.14792
>>14677a moid that talks shit about Zoro??? You should've gotten a lotto ticket because thats rare.
No.14794
>>14774Is this… really a thing? Seriously? Like I'm not too terribly shocked given the current state of everything, fandom included, but I'm just trying to fathom how that works. Do they just consume short-form ~content~ and that's it? If you've seen this behavior out in the wild (which I'm sure many of you have), I'd love to hear horror stories.
I just don't get it, discovering new media either because I saw fan art, or trying something new and then acquiring a new ship is one of my favorite things about being a fujo. I've discovered so many great pieces of media that are excellent on their own, regardless of shipping, because I've either a) heard there was a ship in there, or b) because I feel like I could potentially ship something.
No.14795
>>14794Not that nonna but yeah. It's not even a zoomer only thing, a bunch of friends of my age (30+) do it too. They didn't even do it in the past. It's honestly unironically socmedia and youtube I think. Some can watch a 2h long boring as shit "opinion piece" on youtube but they say they couldn't focus on a 20 min. long anime episode.
I also fear that outtakes on youtube and tiktok, wikia summaries and discord posting made everybody feel like watching or reading a series. I never understood the point but these people (especially if it's zoomers) genuinely think that listening to a summary was the same experience as engaging with a series because PLOT and memes.
I wouldn't mind too much if these people at least stayed the fuck away from discussions and fan spaces then but no. They engage in that because they're addicted to stupid fun posting or they go to /a/ to shit on a series they never watched. I fucking hate it. Maybe I am too pessimistic but I see so many people who follow series that way that I believe it's the majority by now.
Nobody plays single-player games either anymore. It's maybe not as bad since I guess they have all the context when they watch full let's plays but I don't understand it either. The whole mentality I mean. The wish to learn about a series but refuse to read, play or actually watch it despite liking it.
Maybe they want space to project? If you only half-know a series you can fill the holes with own projections of shit they desire. Maybe it's that. No idea. For others it's just the desire to be up-to-date and roleplay fan behavior to fit in.
No.14796
>>14794>Do they just consume short-form ~content~yes. a lot of newgens just watch tiktok videos of characters "aura farming" with "cool" music in the back and that's how they form their opinions on characters. it's also why they often think the characters in question talk like quirky twitter posts and that in turn leads to the rise in even more horribly ooc chatfic. but like
>>14795 said, it's not just zoomers who don't interact with source material. i'm 34 and have been writing rp for over 20 years. there's always been a handful of people on the (non english) site i'm on that just happen to be into every fandom imaginable but their portrayal of characters was always insanely ooc or followed the same patterns with every character even though it didn't even fit. i eventually found out that most of them maybe watch the 1st episode of an anime or a few chapters of the manga and then get the rest of their "information" from fanart they see on pinterest or fandom posts on twitter/tumblr. this was years ago so i'm guessing they have also started to include tiktok videos.
>>14795>The wish to learn about a series but refuse to read, play or actually watch it despite liking it. this reminds me of this massive outcry in the resident evil fandom a while ago when it turned out that a bunch of younger, apparently exclusively female fans who are incredibly loud about their gripes with the games actually haven't played the games at all. they just read leon x reader fanfic, watch leon thirst trap videos and chat with leon chatbots on janitor.ai and that's how they form their "resident evil fan" identity. and when called out they claimed that the games are boring and they can't even watch a let's play of them because - get this - it's just so boring to them. i know zoomers accuse everyone of being performative and larping, but neither of these terms have the judgmental air of "fake fan" that we used to hurl at people during the 2000s. bring back calling people fake fans!!
No.14797
>>14794>If you've seen this behavior out in the wild (which I'm sure many of you have), I'd love to hear horror stories.I apologize because I already posted it somewhere, but:
>twitter fan who is absolutely obsessed with evil squad from a Transformer series (they're cool but think of Sturmabteilung or ISIS)>talks about headcanons every day, mostly mundane shit>avatar, art etc. all she has depicts them as cute chibis, especially her favorite. I don't think much of itFast forward three years or so
>she suddenly screeches about being spoiled after a commenter of her art says something everybody should know>big "??" over my head, observe her closer out of curiosity>turns out she never engaged with that story she's such a fan of for ages>eventually decides to finally read it>realises she hates it She deleted her whole account a day later.
I crazy how a series about war with gore, dark themes and mentally broken killers can possibly perceived as cute fluff to people who only engage with it through funny discord memes. Maybe we should post more spoilers in fandoms to force these types of fans to either interact with the story they believe to love or go lmao
No.14798
>>14797I'm surprised she deleted her account instead of doubling down on blorbos. She might even have learned from this!
No.14800
>>14799why do these fuckers not stick to movies and tv fandoms where all you have to do is hit play and watch? why ruin games?
No.14801
>>14796>yes. a lot of newgens just watch tiktok videos of characters "aura farming" with "cool" music It's the worst because Transformers is famous for re-using names with unrelated characters for copyright. There's videos of 'same character' when they're not. The Bay movies have their own universe with interpretations of characters so far removed that it's only the name. But someone who's never seen more than a youtube clip (and you know because it'll have a channel logo or youtube audio errors) will put Sideswipe and Sideswipe in the same video.
The wiki doesn't help because they mix continuities and give outright wrong info about every character. But no one has made a continuity accurate wiki ever.
No.14802
>>14797>evil squad from a Transformer seriesI wonder if it were Seekers or Combaticons.
Starscream and that specific team get babyfied thanks to the comics and people just watch an endless sludgefest of edits to doja and the weekend. Surprise. Starscream wants to kill people because he genuinely likes doing it and the Combaticons are all a different variant of insane.
I'd post a comic panel but I think it'd actually break board rules. So have this instead.
No.14803
>>14800Unfortunately, because game fandoms are more active and more creative. If it's a currently active franchise or a live service game, you'll never run out of content vs a movie or a tv show that will inevitably end, and while some people may stick with it for a while, they'll eventually move on. The same can be said for some single player games too unless they are constantly being relevant in various ways.
No.14805
>>14803It's beginning to look like unless a series is outright spiteful to western sensibilities or women, this will happen.
I remember when Golden Kamuy was airing, and despite it's massive homo pandering, it never caught on with westerners. Omnimusha and a lot of difficulty heavy games with predominantly male casts are hitting the same. It's got all the ingredients but will not appeal to the west and will stay off the tiktok radar
No.14806
>>14802It was probably the DJD
No.14807
>>14806Gestapo Command
Cannibal
Vore death
Lobotomy Dog
The dog's owner
SAW II
And Dr. Giggles
Sounds about right if you only got your lore from youtube shorts.
No.14809
>>14799Dear god please don't let this become a trend. What's next, novels and tv series ending with short summaries of the chapters/episodes so that people with reading and attention issues can just follow those instead?
>>14802What
>>14806 said kek. The avatar and obsession was about Kaon in particular and I met that user because my very first fanart for Transformers was Kaon as well kek. These guys and specially their yandere leader are fun villains and I enjoy cute stuff too when it's funny but it's hard to imagine that you could google these dudes without being aware of what they are.
But you are completely right about Starscream regardless. Such a great character and so massacred by a large part of the fandom who only watch some outtakes in which Megatron punches that guy to project the battered wife imagine into him. Starscream is probably even more evil than Megs himself since he does it for narcissist self-love whereas Megs is often just obsessed with resentment. Doesn't make him better either, but Starscream is more self-centered and that make him so enjoyable to watch.
No.14810
>>14807>Sounds about right if you only got your lore from youtube shorts.We need to start calling people posers again.
No.14811
>>14810Larp needs to fade into obscurity first. Because posers is the most definite word.
>>14809>Megatron punches that guy to project the battered wifeI would argue Prime started this and IDW cemented it. By later IDW he's gone from gleefully killing people to lying in bed at night pining for Bumblebee
No.14813
>>14800They see nerds having fun and talking to each other based on a shared interest, they want to barge in, but don't want to put in any effort to play video games because it's an interactive medium. It's all fomo.
No.14814
>>14805Golden Kamuy is such a weird case because it's so aggressively homo and contains so many varied dudes and most of them are broken or menhera on top of it or yanhomo and yet no westerner seems to read or watch it and instead complains when turbo heterosexual shounen like Dandadan turn out to be not gay. But even when friends ask for gay recs they never listen to me and watch it. Same with Bravern btw which is also gay as hell and openly so and even makes the love to MC a central plot point, but nah. Completely under the radar of the west for some reason.
I mean by I guess it's a good thing. But still. I would love to have more people to talk about such series sometimes.
>>14807It's kinda tragic because besides all the horrors they commit there is so much more about them and Tarn in particular that I love to see fans explore. There are so many implications made with the whole Damus->Glitch->Tarn deal, his love for classic music, his power that might have caused the empurata sentence, his body change and implied body hate, the fact that he has the same shape as Roller, a guy he once looked up to, his obsessive love for Megs who never acknowledged him because he's the monster he created and so on.
And then there are people who claim that you won't miss anything if you watch tiktok summaries instead of reading the original and obsess over and interpret every single panel and word, like a real fujo does.
No.14815
>>14814IMO Bravern wasn't a particularly interesting sandbox and GK is so objectively good/airtight it's hard for brainworms to find an opening. All the stuff that gets a big, active fandom is mid with an appealing sandbox.
Also let's not pretend some of the insane eyebrows in GK (and now Dogsred) are easy to look past, lol.
No.14816
>>14802>>14811Yeah Prime was what attracted these fans. Though Cyberverse was where I realised they weren't watching the shows. They got so mad it turned into half of a flame war because there was a scene in that series where Megatron is seriously beating Starscream up and it looks kinds brutal. But right before Starscream almost killed him, burned him alive, made a coup, hurt Soundwave and did a bunch of other shit. The punching was just Megatron's retribution after surviving. Megs is also quite different from the genocidal Megatron in IDW or Bay and such. They aren't the same characters but those fans don't get it.
They only saw the beating scene and boycotted the series because they equal a cartoon villain who beats up another villain after almost killing him to actual real life abuse.
Whether a series is garbage or the best shit ever is decided by some youtubers or mere tiktok memes and once such people have formed an opinion nothing will ever change it because they refuse to interact directly with creative works for some reason.
No.14817
>>14814>Damus->GlitchI blame the comic's pacing for this one. JRO wanted to go more into it, but what makes it genuinely the worst is how there's the potential that Roller would have been Tarn but they did a last minute change so readers wouldn't have predicted it. Like hahaha you idiots thought you knew!
That said.
As a massive Tarn fan, I hate that I cannot engage with almost any fan work because they see him as a sexy yandere and not someone who genuinely hates himself as much as he hates other people. He's a fanatic in the same way a cultist is. Cults aren't fun or sexy. They can be in fiction of course, but he comes off as the not fun kind.
No.14819
>>14816>They only saw the beating scene and boycotted the series because they equal a cartoon villain who beats up another villain after almost killing him to actual real life abuse. The scene got me to watch that full series and I hate it. Because of the tone. It's too kiddy to be for older teens, but too violent to be for kids. With the worst voice acting in anything TF related since the Omnidubs and that one PS1 game. But the writing studio that made it also did Combiner Wars, Netflix and Earthspark. You can kind of feel the IDW, mischaracterization in just about every single one of the cast and it gets worse when they're consumed through summaries, reactions and 15 second amvs
No.14822
>>14817tbh while the reasoning is stupid I was always a fan of Tarn being Glitch instead of Roller, because it explains his insecurities so much better. He was just the little socially awkward weak rando without a face whom Orion barely acknowledged who wanted to become the big scary man and the first time we see him post-transformation is when he successfully traumatized and mindbroke his former comrade Skids.
Anyway TF is especially prone to the socmedia misinterpreation bullshit because most fans don't even understand it's different series. I feel like most got into the fandom with Prime and get mad when characters with the same name as Prime characters act differently in a different series because they don't get they're different characters and digesting ever fandom through video essays and discord jokes doesn't really help.
>>14819The childishness is honestly the issue I have with almost all cartoons so far, especially those that feature humans. I can only stomach the ones without kids because at least there are no loud american teenagers that I am supposed to selfinsert into.
No.14823
>>14817I think JRo's issue is that he cannot take any criticism well, and it absolutely wrecks his writing. when fans sided against Megatron in MTMTE, he threw such a giant fit that he trainwrecked his other established characters (Getaway, mostly) in a 'see, but the other side is worst!' move. Ignoring that he wrote the most evil version of Megatron to date. And, like you said, people theorized that Roller had become Tarn, which was probably the plan, but Shocking Twist outweighs good writing and foreshadowing.
Tarn is great, but holy shit can nobody write him correctly.
>>14822>Anyway TF is especially prone to the socmedia misinterpreation bullshit because most fans don't even understand it's different seriesThis has always been an issue (sensitive turncoat Armada!Starscream usurping evil bitchy G1!Starscream's personality for a while in the 'oughts), but it's only gotten worse since then.
No.14825
I believe that the whole lesbians/tranny deal and most other stuff nonnas get mad about are actual consequences of people not engaging with source material. They get their infos from fanworks that might actually be themselves just derivatives of other fanworks all of people who never interacted with the original series and what is eventually left is selfinsert bullshit with manga samurai who turn into genderfluid anxiety bags.
No.14826
>>14814>and yet no westerner seems to read or watch it I've seen this said so many times and I can only assume everyone means Americans because in European fandom there's shitloads of Golden Kamuy fans, I can't open discord without seeing someone using Ogata or Tsukishima as their pfp. I swear the whole of Finland must have read it.
No.14827
>>14826Most GK fans I've encountered in the West were Aidens in their teens or early 20s, so it makes sense to me that the nonas here rarely see people talk about it if they avoid those circles.
No.14828
>>14799This is so depressing. The quote from the screenshot you posted also highlights another issue I've noticed: people not staying in one fandom for very long/not being able to concentrate on one interest for more than a month because attention spans are fried/more and more shit is being pumped out to cater to the lowest common denominator fans that just want flavor-of-the-week slop so the market is oversaturated.
I'm really struggling with fatalism when it comes to fandom engagement. I used to love sharing fanworks, and I still create for myself, but I feel like there's no incentive to share things publicly because part of the enjoyment for me was forming friendships and fujoing out for extended periods of time. Because I tend to gravitate toward small fandoms/rarepairs, there's a smaller pool of people for me to engage with, and now with how fucked everything is that pool feels even smaller. Add in avoiding gendie/moralfagging shit and there's practically no one left. I try to tell myself that there's probably fujos who'd silently enjoy what I make but it's so disheartening.
No.14829
>>14800they can't even watch movies or tv properly that's the thing lol
>why ruin gamesas another nona>>14796
perfectly pointed out with the resident evil Leon thing, they wanna "join" a fandom without necessary knowing everything or being gatekept, a similiar thing happened with BL, starting with tumblr and the influx of non fujos joining in bl without actually being fujo at all just a yume that wanted to fit in, these people completely destroyed the hobby because it doesn't appeal enough to them.
It's funny how this is a cross media problem.
No.14830
>>14828I stumbled across this old forum for a fandom I like, and man, was it just a different culture. It's tragic what's happened to fandom over the years. I don't know if it can ever be fixed. I still see sparks of how it used to be, and it's all the more tragic for it.
No.14839
>>14837it's all newgens who came from LADs pushing this attitude. They act so high and mighty when the only reason their game bans BL is because the Chinese government literally made it illegal (and they still advertise the game on BL sites kek). If China ever loosens their homosexuality laws, they'll commit mass suicide because all the companies will jump to grab a piece of the fujo market they were denied and fill their games with bait.
No.14841
>>14837I think one bl gacha got posed but it cane back in another form? Tbh I don't think there's enough bl games to begin with for there to be a trend of flopping, everything seems to do at least pretty okay.
No.14845
>>14837>Side note, I keep seeing hetjoshis / yumes online saying fujos don't pay up and we've had several of our games declare EOS? Can someone give any examples bc I don't really play fujo gamesAnecdotal assumption: in my 20 years' worth of being a fujo online I've noticed a good amount of us are just the m/m shipping kind and not also the "regularly enjoys original BL, especially enough to pay for it" kind. I can't speak for every fujo, but no original BL has ever beaten anything in my OTP mind palace and I don't think it ever will. How do you sell a jug of milk to somebody who milks their own cow?
Meanwhile hetfags/otome players don't often have the "free/fandom" option, so if you do make something to their taste they are much more likely to buy it.
Also I agree with
>>14841 in that the sample size of live service BL games is way too small to draw any conclusions from.
No.14847
>>14845>Meanwhile hetfags/otome players don't often have the "free/fandom" optionYes they do. That's just a them problem not being creative or passionate enough to get the cow from the pasture and milk it
No.14848
>>14837There is no way she unironically typed this out kek. Lads fans not even once.
No.14850
>>14847They get lame canon milk from cows fed with inferior grass.
No.14851
>>14850They don’t even know how to milk canon het content for themselves.
No.14852
>>14850And yet they refuse to give them organic grass powered by fervor and imagination, which is completely free and fair-traded. That is their problem! Instead they stare with burning envy at the fujo farms and their fat cows and their bulls getting milked by other bulls.
No.14853
>>14852>their bulls getting milked by other bulls.TOPKEK
No.14856
>>14849Name? I kinda wanna check this out now
No.14857
>>14799> Playing FF7R for the plot> using a squeenix game to cry about consoomersLol, lmao even.
>And today, we’re creating games for that audience.They’re designed with that audience in mind, because it’s just one option. Combat gameplay was one of the few saving graces the two other FF7R had going on for them.
If you look at the credits for Rebirth, most of it was outsourced, and that’s the real problem. 1) Squeenix hasn’t operated as a studio for over a decade. It’s now a glorified publisher that farms their IPs and commissions and oversees development. 2) This "feedback" is telling one thing only: they are not learning and not thinking the problem comes from their writing/bad game design choices. “It’s too hard / it takes too long, here’s have a cheatcode if you're tired of our game,” is about the only thing they are willing to adress.
No.14862
I wonder what it is about fujoshi that gets everyone up in arms. We're just chilling enjoying our ships and having fun and everyone finds a way to blame us for all their lack in their fandoms kek.
Whatever its fun in this little corner.
No.14863
>>14862I think some of it is jealousy. People lament how "unfair" it is that m/m "gets" all the fanfiction. People too lazy to write their own wish they had fujo passion.
No.14864
>>14863its funny how they look at fanfics from a strictly numberfagging POV and not just something they do out of genuine love for their favorite pairing/media. I swear yurifags were chiller 15 years ago until performative gen Z lesbians started feeling insecure for whatever reason.
No.14865
>>14625All this hate against feminine uke is making me mad. You hate him for being petite? Submissive? Pretty? Well guess what you nailed it, that's called babyfication and women have been depicted that wat forever without judgement because there are creepy, predatory men. So it's only right there's a media men are also extremely fetishized.
No.14867
>>14866Yessss make them whimpering sluts
No.14870
>>14869This is depressing, like pushing fujos out of internet. What will remain of the social media I wonder?
No.14872
>>14871Saaame. I thought that I wouldn't be bothered by it until I played the game and now I am just trying not to be negative or think too much about it. I am really curious on whether this game is going to be more popular than 3H or has a prominent fujo fandom presence in the future though. Feels like I barely see any fan content of it unless I look for it intentionally.
No.14873
>>14872seems like the game might have flopped given its on a brand new system most people don't really own yet. Had it released on the switch and switch 2 it'd be doing better.
I remember when 3 houses first came out and you couldn't avoid it.
No.14874
>>14862I think I know
>Fujoshi constantly 'undervalue' or 'twist' male characters - male friendships into being gay or romantically involved. This upsets the average male otaku because they don't want to find gayshit of the character they find cool. The same can apply to a yume or a 'normal fan' who doesn't want to see 'gay things'. >There's always a constant stigma around M/M romances compared to F/F or F/M be it canon or non-canon, people are more willing to accept fetishized F/F even in mainstream media but never M/M for whatever reason. So seeing M/M is considered more 'abnormal' or 'disgusting', or they bring the 'you're just fetishizing it' to discredit it and hide their disgust for it>Fujoshi are BIG in numbers and once fujoshi get a hold of a franchise or a character, you will keep seeing ship art or 'gay' art of those characters / franchise. They will always vastly outnumber yumes or hetfags. They make all the fics, all the doujins, fan merch, fan videos, etc. Fujoshi are very resourceful.>Majority of fujos are actually very talented and dedicated. Even when they aren't drawing ship art, they can be professional artists or have high positions at companies or simply have lots of popularity as a fandom writer/fanartist as opposed to a yume or hetfag who are always inherently niche. There is not a single "ultra popular yume fanartist everyone knows" but there are plenty examples of illustrators that are amazing and well known and are turbo fujos on the side (like my pic related, artist Rei, very well known for gorgeous illustrations and also making tons of polnareff porn). There's also starshadowmagic, liduke, etc.>Companies know that fujoshi are the ones that make or break a fandom and therefore whether merch of their property even sells, they will deliberately pander to them subliminally in character interactions or even character designs. This upsets 'normal fans' because they'd immediately clock some characters as 'fujobait'>Fujos express their sexuality somewhat openly through M/M works and aren't afraid of exploring taboo topics or more 'problematic' dynamics like incest or shota. Not that there aren't waifufags or yumes that are similar, but because fujos are bigger in number, it's more noticeable that say, a father/son incest pairing is more popular due to the work of fujoshi than it'd be because of yumesSo tldr; most likely jealousy around women who are able to express their love for something even if it was something silly like a M/M pair when you "should" be "normal" liking het stuff or subliminally keep being complacent to men
No.14876
>>14875>cuteiful heroineIdgi wouldn’t they prefer a more plain heroine for self-insert purposes?
No.14877
>>14876My guess is that these women are self-conscious and feel pressured to abide by male standards, so if the heroine isn't pretty/titillating enough then she isn't worthy of the hot guy. You also have moid editors hijacking these manga and forcing the authors to make them more appealing to men hence why the fls tend to be hypersexualized, and we all know how bad it is in japan especially with their beauty standards and misogyny.
No.14878
>>14876That's more of a male thing, no? Women always tend to dress themselves up and make themselves super cute or pretty when it comes to self-insert OCs and in-game character creation.
No.14879
>>14876otome fans love beautiful and stylish kind-hearted heroines
No.14880
>>14878Men seem to like the lowest common denominator of a character so they can project themselves over it, whereas women seem to want the glamour fantasy. I think this also explains Mary Sues.
No.14881
>>14880>I think this also explains Mary Sues.Did you miss the last multiple decades of fandom drama surrounding them or were you not alive for them.
No.14882
>>14876I mean OP said she's a lolicon so maybe she self inserts as that?
No.14884
>>14875>tall fag gigachad with huge hands grabbing her by the chinI love how its literally just the same cover as most old school bl and these people are acting so mighty and highty loool
No.14885
>>14876Usually, the self insert has to be either beautiful or, even if she has a plain design, she has to be treated as if she is popular in the universe and all male characters fall for her.
No.14887
Isn't yaoi mainly drawn porn for women? If porn is a 'necessity' then why should women pander and pacify antis to sacrifice this part of her sexuality?
No.14888
>>14887Good point, but using their own retard logic against them never works. They've always got an exception and an excuse lined up.
No.14889
>>14625When I see fujos at concerts being 'fugly' I actually feel happy because finally these women have externalized their pleasure from patriarchal validation onto their interests instead.More women should be fugly. More women shouldn't give a fuck. Because the other pipeline is caving in and trooning out, or simply giving up being a fujoshi- which is giving up yourself.
Both ways you are a depressing reality of a woman who lost her identity.
No.14891
"This whooole fandom sees B as top when I see him as bottom :(((" Yeah that's true for the EN side in recent years, but can you really complain when for the last decade+5 the majority of japanese fanbase always had B as the designated bottom of the ship and there's endless content of that, even today coming out every day, like, you are not starving at all. Ao3 as well has endless fics of B bottom because, it's been a looong time and this is the most popular basic bitch ship of the game…..
No.14893
>>14891some people just want to feel victimized for being soooo unique and having such an acquired taste. I have fellow fujo friends who were stupidly proud of liking old men or enjoying bara but eventually that wasn't considered cool or unique anymore so they quietly stopped bragging about liking this stuff. like more power to you if you genuinely enjoy this stuff but acting like you are so unique and maybe even just pretending to like it to be nlof (not like other fujos) is cringe. personally I always like to see my favorite character bottom, even when the fandom prefers him as a top, but I'm a bit self conscious about that since people often assume that you as a fujo project on the bottom or something. but idk I just love seeing my best boy get absolutely wrecked by another guy… especially because I tend to like snarky/mean characters like tsukishima from hq or felix from fe3h.
No.14895
I hate crackships, especially ones that get extremely popular. I feel conflicted about it because I like that it's a show of creativity and fandom is for fun at the end of the day, but I get pissed off when a crackship overtakes a bunch of canon ships when it has no substance. I'm also a canon shill and prefer canon-compliant stuff so it adds to my annoyance when people completely disregard it. At that point just make OCs. The fact that shit like Jegulus has 28k fics genuinely makes me seethe kek
No.14899
>>14898just tell us what the game is. we're all anonymous here anyway.
No.14900
>>14889I feel like this is about me even though I don't even try to be non-conforming, but that's my problem.
No.14901
>>14898Please write a review in
>>>/ot/7596 No.14902
>>14898Tell me the vn name or I glue your favorite uke's buttcheeks shut
No.14903
>>14901Funny thing is, I was typing out a review of all the available demos, but I felt way too embarrassed to post it on the imageboard where I had initially planned to post it, and I gave up halfway. I was at 900ish words when I quit. Maybe I will try to finish the review
and read that one scene again. Just to make sure I remember the plot that I read earlier this week, of course.>>14899>>14902Doing this for the sake of my favorite uke's buttcheeks.
It's called Unraveling Angel: Coward's Paradise. The main female love interest's design is deeply off-putting, as well as the way she is written, and the two promised male love interests are hideous. Also, there are multiple demos with varying levels of gay shit in them. The Steam demo has the most gay shit, but not the specific scene my post mentioned. Please don't make me regret posting this.
No.14904
>>14898>>14903Steal those characters and make them OCs! That's what I do when the source material fails me or I need more content of a certain ship lol
I also second you posting a review, if you feel comfortable of course
No.14905
>>14876You are right, but she has to be cute and generic as possible, look this is the portrait of the heroine of tokimeki memorial girls side, its literally just a doodle of a cartoon girl, while the male characters have a complete anime portrait.
It's not that different from the faceless male character in hentai vn, with the exception that the girl has a cute ribbon.
Nekopara for example, the main character doesn't even have the main character sprite.
No.14906
>>14893Eww I hate bara or simply drawing any husbandos as hairy fatties. The other day I took a plunge in /Yaoi/ and it's full of bara, I've completely given up on finding any community in 4chan
No.14909
>>14905Tokimeki heroine is a unique case, while the standard eyeless heroine with shoulder length brown hair exists there are also a lot of heroines who are in my opinion designed cuter than all the male LIs and enough people have similar opinions to make it kind of a meme in otome fandom. The outfits are usually pretty if nothing else.
No.14910
>>14907I will never EVER understand how Klance got as huge and cancerous as it did. People to this day swear that it was obvious they were going to get together when it wasn't. I didn't like Sheith either. I hated all the gay ships for that awful reboot.
No.14911
>>14910I'm guessing because gaybait in itself is honestly kinda rare in western cartoons so any male interaction at all looks like a feast. All the big western ships are mostly live-action, the cartoon fujos were probably starving and snapped at the first thing they got in a while (and went crazy in the process).
No.14912
>>14910I find it very interesting that most Klance shippers later turned into yumes and/or kpop stans while Sheith shippers stayed fujos, there has to be some kind of a correlation there.
No.14913
>>14912A lot of Klance shippers wanted to fuck Lance and were just using Keith as a self-insert
No.14914
>>14913Ew. Ladies please love yourselves
>>14911And it wasn't even remotely close to the sort of gaybait you see in anime or manga. Perhaps that's why I was immune to that cancer when it first aired. But I do admit bias as I literally did grow up with the original Voltron so I wasn't rooting for either gay ship. Though I really really lament that Keith and Lotor never met. They could have been a great angst ship
No.14916
>>14913Yeah that's what I figured kek, even during the big drama years of 2017-2018 it was obvious to me that a lot of the "Sheith is a pedo ship" bullshit was because teenage girls were grossed out by an adult gay man and wanted to have their twink ship to be able to date the bishie bad boy. Klance shippers would be the ones to sperg about Valko on LADS today.
No.14917
>>14912interesting, I always thought free and it's ship wars had a hand in some of the craziness of vld too. I didn't care much for rinharu vs. makoharu since the show served us so much delicious fujobait and I loved it all but the lengths to which fencer-x went to make rinharu seem canon…?! I kind of understood why some makoharu fans were crazy neurotic when THE rinharu bnf made wrong translations on purpose just to spite them.
No.14918
Publishing companies where I live are only translating things I don't care about. In terms of BL the only things I'm looking forward to are a few sequels here and there that will probably publishing in one or two years because of how slow BL publications can be. How boring.
>>14869>part of the communityLiterally what community? You can like otome games or BL or both at the same time without being part of a community. Twitter is a social media platform and not a forum, and tagging may as well not exist there as well, so there's no community in there except maybe for a few random people here and there who decide to befriend each other because they have the same hobbies and tastes. You can play dozens of otome games a month and do it by yourself without joining some stupid forum or discord server either. People online need to stop using the words "community" and "fandom" incorrectly all the time, it's getting ridiculous.
No.14923
>>14910I think people just wanted to ship two guys but thought Shiro was too old since they grew up on tumblr where female socialization lashings were frequent.
>>14912Them having a crush on Lance probably also contributed kek, Sheith just is the more traditional fujo ship on top of that so most of the people who shipped it already liked fujo culture.
No.14924
>>14917>some makoharu fans were crazy neurotic when THE rinharu bnf made wrong translations on purpose just to spite themWas it fencer-x, kek? She's still kicking around, she scanlated for Sasaki to Miyano for a while and then someone found out she egregiously mistranslated something from the sister series (Hirano to Kagiura, there's a lot of seethe from StM fans of it so it tracks kek) and all of a sudden she dropped the series. She was also a huge moralfag who fit the stereotype of a StM fan despite her well-documented interest in shit like Sekaichi Hatsukoi (she used to say JJR was wayyyy worse kek).
No.14925
>>14924Wow that takes me back. I remember when she and Audrey/Aitaikimochi seemed to be the biggest names in the tumblr Free! fandom.
No.14926
>>14923>female socialization lashingsthis is such an apt way to put it. i remember when some teenage fujo made a post about why she loved some ship (i think oikawa and kageyama from hq?) and one reason was that she thought about them having sex all the time. which is very… teenage fujo like. let's not pretend that most of us haven't been there, kek. and people, fellow fujos included, tore her to shreds for saying that and claimed that she was gross/sex obsessed. meanwhile i just thought damn girl, you are so right, that ship is hot, of course i'd also be thinking of them fucking all the time.
>>14924fencer-x is like an immortal cockroach, kek. i also find it remarkable that she is "allowed" to write hp fanfic even though jkr is sooo evil and most tumblr fujos are woke TRAs. there was also some drama about 10(+) years ago about her scanlating yaoi manga and blocking japanese IPs so the creators wouldn't find out about the scanlations or something. everyone acted like she was so evil for going behind the sacred nihongese people's backs but at the same time… would THEY want for their fave yaoi to be taken down because of copyright claims??
>>14925audrey always rubbed me the wrong way, ngl. she always seemed like an inauthentic, superficial businesswoman who pretended to be a fangirl so actual fangirls would trust her and buy from her stupid online store.
No.14927
>>14923>Sheith just is the more traditional fujo shipFrom what I saw Klance was getting casted in the standard red/blue shonen rivalship template, so also traditional despite that not really being the canon dynamic between the characters.
>I think people just wanted to ship two guys but thought Shiro was too oldProbably this as well. Even for teens who are not poisoned by age gap discourse most of them probably still care more about the characters closer to their age.
No.14928
>>14927Honestly having watched the first season of VLD recently, I’m not surprised they latched onto red/blue considering there’s hardly any ship bait between any characters except Allurance. I can’t say for the second season and beyond though.
No.14929
>>14926NTA, Audrey pisses me off.
I got into her for awhile back when I was deeper into MHA because she had translations and also just so happened to like all the things I liked. Her OMG VINCENT SQEEEEE fangirling was cringe but genuine.
But then it kept going in a loop and her being a FF14 yumeshipper seemed to take precedence over everything. She's rich too so she can afford every kind of commission she wants to shove it in her audience's faces. Which is annoying.
It's like she's one part e-girl, one part fujo, one part yumeshipper and is trying to present herself as "one of us" as she links you to her import shop.
It certainly seems genuine but then she'll mention her house in California ($$$) while she's streaming in her house in Japan and then posts weekly photos of going to Disney with her celebrity friends. It's so corporate and makes all her "exciting" posts read disingenuous because no shit she thinks the newest statue is awesome she'll get it for free from the directors themselves.
No.14930
>>14926It's so frustrating to me how female dominated spaces still have this "you can't like sex too much" attitude meanwhile in male spaces they can goon to their heart's content. I'm even seeing a revival of this on tumblr where new waves of "fujos are misogynistic because they don't care about female characters" posts keep popping up, and anyone who goes "but I like men and want to goon to men" are told "you should care about more than gooning". Of course they say this to women and don't bother male hentai fans
No.14932
As a millennial fujo, seeing the fujo-yume-het wars develop in real time is wild because growing up tbh all the young fujos had a bit of yume in them. It made sense because if you liked the character, you were attracted to them: Sasuke, Cloud, Sephiroth, Kurama, Kaiba, etc. There were no labels or factions like fujo or yume or social media; you were just a fangirl. Back in the day (mid 2000s) yaoi was novel too (gay acceptance was much lesser) so the main rivalry was yaoi and het. The common story among my friends and I is that we watched whatever was on Cartoon Network or the Kids WB, latched onto bishies we liked, found yaoi of them, and the rest is history.
Yume didn’t even enter the international weeb lexicon until around the late 2010s (iirc an otome blogger brought it to the west) and the pandemic crystallized yumeshipping/self-inserting as a phenomenon. Back then (pre 2010s) people still made OCs and self-shipped, but it was considered cringe and juvenile (eg Mary Sue as an insult) and more or less limited to pockets of sites like Deviantart. The post-pandemic yume/fujo war always came off as extremely one-sided too, like yumes on LC seething at fujos.
Looking at Audrey’s LinkedIn I see her job trajectory is textbook “millennial weeb who studied Japanese and made a career of it”. She’s also in the middle-millennial age range and sells to weebs as her full time job so I wouldn’t compare lifestyles with her. I think she lucked out due to a number of reasons - being located in LA good for logistics, had a background in Japanese/e-commerce/media, launched her business in the late 2010s right as anime was becoming mainstream - so it makes sense she can afford that lifestyle. Not trying to WK for her, I just think it’s kinda wild people are accusing her of being a fake fan given the context I just described. I’m not aware of her having BNF milk à la fencer, but she’s definitely no AddyHarajuku.
No.14933
>A REAL m/m fan never speaks ill of terrible canon female love interest xD
stfu
No.14934
>>14933The people posting hate aren't bringing up poor writing because they're like this with every female character with any prominence.
Like Tifa/Aerith hate.
Character bashing is annoying once you're no longer 14.
No.14935
>>14933I do and with much gusto
No.14936
>>14934It's less about hate and more about performatively loving the female character, so you don't get cancelled for misogyny. Also character hate / bashing is fun sometimes when tagged, sorry.
No.14937
>>14936NTA but I shamefully admit I love characters bashing.
Even the few het pairs I do ship I still like reading character bashing fics of their canon love interests. It’s annoying seeing people performatively loving female characters and then in the same breath they’ll bash another female character for getting in the way of the canon ship.
No.14938
>>14936I'd rather have the most seething hate of a female character than the phoney 'omg i love herrrrrrr, she's too good for himmmmm'. I get why fujos need to do it, but it's so annoying to see.
No.14939
>>14938kek I especially like the ones that claim to love a female character sooo much that they conveniently headcanon her as a lesbian. I'm a fujo but I also like plenty of het ships so I usually also share het fanart but somehow that makes some people mad too. if you're a fujo you're an evil fetishizer but if you're a het shipper you're a cringe self inserter. so in the end we should all just do and enjoy what we love because people always find a reason to nitpick.
No.14941
>>14926>been there, kek. and people, fellow fujos included, tore her to shreds for saying that and claimed that she was gross/sex obsessed. meanwhile i just thought damn girl, you are so right, that ship is hot, of course i'd also be thinking of them fucking all the time. bro imagine a man saying he thinks about sex all the time, do fellow men tore him to shreds and call him gross.
No they just say "me too bro" at best.
Ugh.
Also it's funny most of it comes from yumes or het shippers, when a lot of them are just as pornbrained if not more. I guess they think liking straight porn makes them not pornbrained, huh no, you are pornbrained if you think about straight sex all the time too kek
>>14932I don't think so, you can find a character attractive without necessary want to ship yourself with him, that's the difference.
Fujos that are yumes often end up saying shit like "i need female characters to self insert" which is where the inner yumes comes forth
No.14942
>>14930Because they know male hentai fans will just spam them with rape/death threats, it's easier for them to target other women.
No.14945
>>14926>>14924>>14917>fencer-xIs it true she had a meltie and went on a cokerant because of the MH confession scene in Starting Days? I wasn't there during the Free! Tumblr days but was told this, plus her mistranslating MH lines and omitting words 24/7, which is crazy kekk
No.14946
>>14941> you can find a character attractive without necessary want to ship yourself with himI don’t disagree with that, just saying it’s natural for a lot of fangirls to also be attracted to characters they like to ship.
No.14949
>>14930I think this is the only safe space, even lc is too far gone
No.14955
>>14949I was bored at work and decided to check out LC (never been into the site that much) and checked some fandom threads incl. the anti fujo thread) and jesus, everyone on LC is so fucking miserable I can't imagine living like this constantly.
No.14957
Didn't really get what's so appealing about yume, anyway the yume community grew insanely toxic.
No.14958
>>14957I think some people are addicted to the adrenaline of getting into online fights.
No.14959
>>14911I think the West just really wanted a rival ship and were hoping it would be like a traditional anime one. My unpopular take is that Harry/Draco is the same, in the canon it doesn't really hold a candle to anime rivalships because they were never given that "obsessed with each other and are part of each other's arc whether they like it or not", people just want the trope because the West is allergic to writing good m/m rivalry.
No.14960
>>14959Harry's got more of a rivalry with Snape than Draco imo. But yeah, they aren't the anime-styled m/m shipbait rivals that fans want them to be.
No.14961
so many faggots mad that women like bara or draw it but will defend TIFs putting a pussy on a bara. so tired of these fake bisexual wokes, i hope more fujos keep drawing bara and showing interst. at least they know what homosexual men are supposed to look like.
No.14962
so many faggots mad that women like bara or draw it but will defend TIFs putting a pussy on a bara. so tired of these fake bisexual wokes, i hope more fujos keep drawing bara and showing interst. at least they know what homosexual men are supposed to look like.
No.14963
I think the West just really wanted a rival ship and were hoping it would be like a traditional anime one. My unpopular take is that Harry/Draco is the same, in the canon it doesn't really hold a candle to anime rivalships because they were never given that "obsessed with each other and are part of each other's arc whether they like it or not", people just want the trope because the West is allergic to writing good m/m rivalry.
No.14964
>>14963Harry Potter is the one series where the straight ships with the MC are better than the gay ones imo (Harmione & Lunarry vs Drarry & Ronarry)
No.14965
>>14962Oh yeah I hate the bara vs femboy wars and the people who claim that liking one or another meant you aren't a woman because "women only like * ". People aren't a hivemind and I happened to be into a lot of different types of dudes, ages and bodytypes, depending on how well their series are written, how charismatic or interesting the characters are, how cool the artstyle is and so on.
I don't even have issues with trans or herm-characters if it's canon. I hate tacked on vagina because it's not. I hate it for the same reason I hate the uglification that tumblr propagates. Same with bodytypes. I am fine with lean and chubby characters but I really, really do not like when fans turn normal weighted dudes into fat ones or canonically big and heavy/fat characters into twinks. The latter also happens with female characters. Canonically huge and scary, but fans turn them into big-titted skinny super models. I especially hate that many of these fans are women themselves.
No.14966
>>14965I got out of the Kingdom Hearts hype right before Sora with a black guy tan became the new hc. No one does this to Riku because he's already gay. But Kairi is drawn fat for some reason and Xion is always trans and black.
Ironically Xemnas is left alone.
No.14967
>>14966Western fandom's obsession with representation is so annoying. I don't mind skin colour changes that much and even racebends as long as they don't take over as the default interpretation + have people calling others racist for not following it, but so many people draw their headcanons as grotesque as possible that it's impossible to disassociate "diverse" art with ugliness.
No.14968
The whole genderbend draco thing blowing up proves to me once again that people are really hypocrites because they'll call you delusional for liking an M/M ship while you bring up the canon material and other shit that links the M/M pairing together but oh somehow SUDDENLY as long as one of them was a woman it makes 100% complete total sense, "how did I not see this!", even if nothing was changed other than the other character happens to be a woman. fuck you.
in a way I guess it's half validating that yes indeed my ship makes fucking sense I fucking told you so but I hate that somehow a well written M/M dynamic (not inherently related to drarry in question either) is always dismissed as delusional by default of it being M/M
No.14969
>>14845original BL does sell really well and has lots of fans that buy official merch. this claim that “fujos don’t pay up” is extremely incorrect when fujos are known to support their favs hardcore. these people don’t know anything because they had no interest in weeb games pre-LADS.
>>14907usually they go for these ships that make no sense only because they consider the ship that actually makes sense too “problematic”. sad. prussia’s and canada’s best ships are with their brothers whether they like it or not.
No.14972
>>14837>Side note, I keep seeing hetjoshis / yumes online saying fujos don't pay up and we've had several of our games declare EOS? Can someone give any examples bc I don't really play fujo gamesThere aren't really any live service fujo games to EOS to begin with except Noctilucent and Nu:Carnival and they're doing fine, NuCani even having a nitro+chiral collab. Zerowake GATES is still in development so we'll have to see where that goes once it releases. I guess Velvet React got EOS'd in a year but that was mostly because it was simply a shit game and people didn't like how it had zero relationship mechanics and only included sex scenes. The reason NuCani became so popular was that Eiden was made a likable protagonist with a bold personality making it an actual BL game instead of an "otome harem but the main is male" like what Velvet React tried doing.
Also there's so much otome shovelware that gets EOS'd in four months after pumping and dumping the audience that people probably just mentally confuse the two genres.
No.14973
>>14972Samefag to add a correction. Velvet React wasn't really even an "otome harem" but more like the main character was used as a personality-less blank slate avatar to watch OTHER characters have sex with each other kek, that's why people called it a NTR/cuck game. I guess there are some fujos who are satisfied with just seeing two random bishies have sex but most of us like a specific couple because they have chemistry and a dynamic that we are interested in and sex is a way to express the feelings between them whatever they might be. Nu:Carnival on the other hand puts a lot of effort in their character writing and it's exactly why it's so successful. It's not that "fujos don't put their money where their mouth is" but that studios developing games don't understand them as an audience or even bother to understand, instead they just treat them as "otome but gay" and think throwing random boring bishies at them works like it does with otome fans who specifically don't want their male characters to have a personality beyond a husbando trope.
No.14974
>>14930>meanwhile in male spaces they can goon to their heart's contentIt depends on the space. Even some anime bros are policing themselves over ages of waifus now. There are also always a few anti porn puritan types but they just show up to say 'ew I disapprove of gooners' while everyone ignores them.
No.14975
>>14930I see this female-socialized behavior all the time on both socmed and female ibs
>porn addiction porn addiction porn addiction>no offense but I'm glad I'm not a coombrain lol I care about the CHARACTERS and SOURCE MATERIAL instead of SEX and PORN>why are you acting like your porn is deep and meaningful>you can never be an good writer or artist if you draw to get off>degen fujos are porn addictsI suspect a lot of this is said by women who feel isolated from other women online because they aren't into yaoi / whatever is popular, especially antifujo hetshippers and yumes. Have your superiority complex all you want. At the end of day I'm the enjoying content I enjoy while you are sad and bitter in a corner.
No.14976
I honestly don't care at all about what people think about me being a fujo. They can call me homophobic, pedophile, misogynist, racist, abuser etc. I’m none of these things and if the definition gets changed and it somehow does apply to me I won’t mind someone calling me that because I know I’m not doing anything wrong. That’s why when I see yumes, yurishitters or even moralfag fujos insult me I can easily ignore it. In fact I wish fujos would get more hate again. For a few years it’s been trendy to call yourself a fujoshi and it let to an epidemic of irony-poisoned pseudo intellectual fujo larpers. I hate them so much for turning BL into some kind of joke that can only be taken seriously if it’s about the struggles of irl faggots
No.14977
>>14958Hate is a market.
>>14974>anti porn puritan Biggots or larpers trying to stir shit aside, most people don't like coming across porn when they aren't looking for it. I've got no sympathy for edgelords or autists who share their porn or fetish in a general discussion/thread. As you said, it depends on the space.
No.14978
>>14976I don't care either. I just read or watch whatever I want whether it's bl or het and I mind my own business because fuck fandoms at that point. I can't even stand the fujoshi with a huge following I randomly come accross on twitter because they're fake as fuck and will talk about gay rep or trans rep, or about their autism and how everyone who's interested in nerdy genres like bl must also be retarded like them in between acting like normal fangirls to lure you in. I also don't care about normalfags' opinions either. Some new girl who was hired at my job a few weeks ago once came to the office with a 50 shades of grey like novel to kill time and another one grabbed it as a joke and read out loud some random lines about a guy getting horny and sucking the female MC's nipples like it's nothing weird in that place and time. Meanwhile I make sure to read my books at home when they're not even nearly as explicit. My stupid country produces retarded disgusting het movies about hideous old men being into way younger and prettier women who are all over them because the ugly old pedo directors and actors self insert as the male main characters, and these trashy movies are deemed as 2deep4u masterpieces instead of some random guy's personal expensive fap material. Why should I be embarrassed that I read manga about good looking men falling in love with each other and kissing in comparison, just because it's niche? No, fuck that.
No.14979
>>14977>Biggots or larpers trying to stir shit aside, most people don't like coming across porn when they aren't looking for it. I've got no sympathy for edgelords or autists who share their porn or fetish in a general discussion/thread. As you said, it depends on the space.For sure, but I'm thinking of the kind of guy who clutches his pearls just at the mention that X fictional character has r34 of them even if said character is the most obvious fanservice design ever. Usually found in Youtube or Reddit comments, so probably just normie-adjacent types. This type of guy is generally shocked by the existence of any fanworks at all except maybe mega crossovers and will lose his shit if someone tells him about yaoi.
No.14981
>>14978are you french? the movie thing sounds french to me, kek.
No.14982
>>14980The fact that there are so many men who are so angry at their recent(!) realisation that Transformers has a million gayship fans is another proof for the inability of most people and especially men have no concept of chemistries and personalities if it isn't about a self-insert.
It's fine to not like a pairing. But to call every shipper of G1 MegaStar or even the IDW bots delusional can only be explained if they only follow those series for the pew pew and funny colors. Sure, maybe some aren't gay, but if two characters are so close or share such a weird rivalry or hatelove with each other that they might as well be you cannot condemn fans for adding 1 to 9 to make it a 10.
No.14983
>>14978>>14976Same here. I don't care about fitting in or identity shit. I only have the "fujo" in my twitter bio to avoid being blocked by the Japanese and scare anti-shippers away. I also enjoy a lot of non-gay shit. Gay is the icing on the cake that gets me really into something, but still enjoy every moment of Jaadugar, TTGL or .hack//Sign. And might also enjoy fucked up gay shit like the gay pairing of BokuDake and don't care.
I even read Golden Kamuy at work or in the subway and if some idiot should show the naked men to others then be it. I am over that shit. Every normalfag openly fawns over their het rape fantasy novels or "grandpa fucking hot 22year old super model" movies, they should look into the mirror.
That said though, I also had to think of French movies when you described that genre lmao
Germany has a similar issue but unlike France they don't even try to come off as deep. It's either stressed middle aged guys finding a girl to fuck, 46yo stressed married women who fall in love with a charming 19 year old Italian because they're "exotic" or some white savior shit with a black trophy wife/husband. Boomers crave that shit. Maybe I am biased, but despite not caring about depth as long as something is entertaining I believe that shit like Golden Kamuy as more to offer than this crap, despite all the evil naked men.
No.14984
>>14982It is fascinating in how they act like it's a new thing. And will deny it ever being a thing until you show them production notes. I've seen their reactions live and it's genuine bafflement to homophobia. Not even ignorant boomer but just complete homophobia and hatred.
Notall of them react that way, but the ones who don't are usually closeted or young themselves.
No.14985
>>14976Ironically not even the real gays I know like the usual type of fluff gay with literally-yous that tumblr and such demands. Hell, I feel like not even tumblr likes it. There was this one super representative sanitized gay comic with the two mutual gay guys that everybody talked about but nobody seemed to like. Some pretended to but I have never seen a single fanart of this or seen them fangirl about it. Instead they keep posting their Mouthwashing, Transformer and Eldritch porn which is based btw but it shows that they are just virtue signalling about the "safe" gay shit.
No.14986
>>14984Yeah they do that with everything that involves women. I assume it's men from conservative families who had zero female friends as kids because they also claim that gaming or coding wasn't a female thing when 60% of the gamers I knew in the 90s were girls obsessed with RPG- and strategy games and early coding was a mostly female thing until men came to make money and then pretended women were too stupid for tech.
The person who first told me about piracy and eDonkey was also a girl.
The funny thing about TF is that they had to know if they were real fans because fujos were always present. But I think that men tend to misinterpret fujoness as husbandofagging. So if you talk a lot about Tarn and Overlord they assume you want to fuck bad boys instead of realising that you want to see them fuck, kek
No.14987
>>14986Assuming you want to fuck them is the most infuriating part about them getting in discussions.
There's a lot of Optimus yumes out there because who wouldn't be attracted to that personality. But they see girls screaming over Perceptor and Brainstorm and think they want to be in the middle. When they were 8 and saw Megan Fox and the girls who can't act in the other films, that's how they comprehended it.
Ironhide and Ratchet are little more than sentient dogs that can shoot blasters to them. And I don't know which is worse. Being accused of wanting to fuck them or being seen as an idiot for trying to engage with the characters in earnest.
No.14988
>>14981>>14983Damn you both clocked me. Yeah I'm French and there's nothing good in French cinema besides animated movies, yet boomers think younger people than them, starting from gen X, are retarded degenerates who prefer Dragon Ball to the average French movie where a walled racist obese old man is seduced by a pretty young female character or the average 2deep4u depressing movie that celebrate beauty or whatever.
>I even read Golden Kamuy at work or in the subway and if some idiot should show the naked men to others then be itIt wouldn't be the end of the world here, the average bus passenger in my city likes to watch AI generated fruits island slop about fruits trying to fuck each other, without earphones of course and as loudly as possible.
No.14989
>>14979> lashe out whenever something don't catter to them or their dick It’s not a normie thing… The only scenario where I could see this genuinely confuse or upset people, is if the characters mentionned are very cartoonish, childlike, or non-human. And Transformers is rather low on the wtf spectrum since those are giant alien sentient robots. It's not like bronies or pokefuckers.
No.14990
>>14988>there's nothing good in French cinema Most of it is slop, same as everywhere, but if you find nothing of value in an industry that is 100 years old then the problem is you and your taste. It's like you're and the other anons are stuck in the 50-60s.
>Peau-d'âne>Le hussard sur le toit>Le compte de monte-cristoThere you're big budgets het romance with no age-gap or ugly leads. All in costumes too.
No.14999
>>14964Nah, they're not. I don't know why people come onto a fujo board to shill het ships and talk about how much better they are. I'll take my m/m notps over any het ship because het shippers are that annoying and never shut up about fujos and spread discourse.
>>14968It also proves that moids are hypocrites about women liking "bad boys" and men act like moralfags until it's something that turns them on, but unfortunately women in fandom are happy to side with moids and also police other women.
No.15009
>>15006Me with Lance Voltron. Will never watch the show but I despise Lance and the Klance ship because of how annoying their fans were and the influence that whole shitshow has to this day.
No.15010
>>15006>ShipsYes all the time
>CharactersIt's more a narrative thing for me, if I genuinely like a character with an annoying fandom I can put that behind me and continue to like them but if they're shitty in the story itself and their fanbase reflects that then it certainly doesn't help.
I wouldn't say it's hate but I never cared for this dude's schizo ass and voted him guilty every round kek.
>>15009Ok you got me there, genuinely fucking hate Lance and Klance because of the fandom.
No.15011
>>15009Lance is such a shit character. I can't believe he got so popular and the writers actually wanted him to get the girl. Allura didn't deserve this
No.15012
>>15011>Could have ended up with hot purple elf prince>Ends up with fugly latino farmer and diesCan't have shit in Altea
No.15013
>>14976Same, I think most reason of why female fandoms care so much about name calling and virtue signaling is because we are susceptible to group think, unlike males that have a tendency to be lone wolfs we can't help but want to be in the group even if the group is retarded and keeps shitting on us.
No.15015
>>15012Maybe that's why she had to die. It was either be with an uggo or cease to exist. She never stood a chance!
>>15013I hate that this is the case for women. I just want to enjoy my m/m stuff in peace and exist without any drama or weirdo ass call outs. It probably didn't help that the internet began to centralize itself so we had no choice but to be within the midst of the fakers
No.15016
>>15009Same. I've gotten the ick from several authors that are writing for ships I LIKE because I visit their bio and see Klance in their works or bookmarks.
>>15012Old Lotor/Allura was my problematic fav from when I was a kid, I'm still mad about the fumble here.
No.15018
>>15014Prussia’s crush on Italy IS super cute and I love it but it always felt so one-sided. I tried reading some doujins with them but even those were one-sided.
No.15042
>>15040It reminds me of when JJK season 2 came out and men who shat on fujoshi all the time formally apologized and admitted Gojo and Geto were gay as fuck on twitter kek. But like if these guys were too stupid to admit it and never apologized instead.
No.15044
>>15040The male mind is so incomprehensible to me.
No.15047
>>15040No different from when the Persona 5 moids admitted Goro would be the canon choice if he were a girl
No.15048
>>15047I never seen this in my life.
No.15049
>>15040>that fanartit's literally sora and riku at the end of kingdom heart 2 holding the keyblade together to defeat xenmas
No.15051
>>15048Granted it was on 4chan but it did happen
No.15052
>>15040It would take moids to ruin one of the most iconic yaoi pairings of the 2000s
No.15057
>>15040Moids, or at least nu-otaku moids, are too retarded to look at old anime that already fulfilled their tsundere fetish because all they know is hype moments and aura shonenshit where the girls basically have negative chemistry with their MCs. They have psyop'd themselves into thinking the most bogstandard (and shitty) genderbend is somehow revolutionary when it's just rehashing the kugyu tsundere trope from the early 2000s and shitty harem tropes also from the 2000s.
At least it's not some shitty tranny acceptance uwu like the Petra parker shit but this is getting on my nerves too. Oh but god forbid fujos start making BL fanart of some popular hetslop or whatever.
No.15058
>>15048> If Sasuke was a girlThat was not a hot take back when Naruto was still running.